1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

For Type 3 and 4 restoration projects, interesting history, adventure trips etc
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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 5th December 2018 - 11:26pm

Yeah a non salty soap is advised. Which I had tried but it still didnt help. The paint just isnt ready and I havent returned to it yet. But I have been pottering away

I cleaned out the rear wing and rear valence cavities and then reprotected with dinatrol 4942 and 1000 for the cavity.

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With the continued fear of bumping into a painted panel, I made the decision it was time to recover to fighting room, so the gearbox was refitted. With a new nose cone mount.

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And then the biggest space hog needed some love, this dusty bugger ran fairly rough and leaked like me after 10 pints.

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The plan being, I know the engine was mechanically fine, it just needed a full regasket and all the tin needed a smarten. I measured the end float and its well with in spec. The firs fight of many was the exhaust, I believe I have joined a rather small club these days of people who have undone the primary heater boxes from the main silencer box. And without the use of an angle grinder.

Over the course of two weeks these 46mm buggers were given liberal gulps of super crank and WD40.

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I spent quite a bit of time with it clamped in a vice and swinging from a huge spanner. But all I managed to do was turn the work bench around. So at that point I fired up the burning gear and went red hot. Then still took me pre loading the spanner and then some hefty thumps with a hyde face to crack off and finally undo.

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I have much more for you and I will give you what you are after later this week :D
The sultan of swing

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 6th December 2018 - 10:50pm

Right ive been up to my eye balls for weeks now and putting this off. So sod it lets have at it and do you a proper update. Im just going to stick the kettle on and make a brew first. Id do the same yourself, its a fair size. See you in 5...............

With the box jobbys undone I got on with the rest of the engine knocked down. And I really went to town. Fan flaps out.

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Helpfully some yeas ago a friend made me this handy spanner to hold the dynamo pulley, its pretty similar to the VW original too and works a treat.

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I seem to remember this was a runaway saturday afternoon, but if im honest I really cant place this on any particular day, other than to say it happened in November 2018. I seem to have developed a muscle memory with these engines and before i realized it was in pieces with out having paid any attention.

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Then light enough for me to lift into the stand and take the heads off. Note the very black oil below, and that isnt from the tray. I shall explain in a matter of some photos time.

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Other matters are pressing, that oil leak I told you about, and youve have since forgotten. Well I didnt want to split the block, but I made myself do it. It was so very well stuck together which is a shame, but the lower front corner had this delight. The oil had breech the liquid gasket due to the over heating incident.

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So worth while splitting the block, even if it had taken up more time I dont really have. ANd after a suitbale clean up, yet again notice the very black much in the sump.

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I rebuilt the engine up to short block and then added the barrels and pistons. That big pile of tinware brackets clips pipes ect all went of to the powder coaters, I took all of the exhaust system too, but just for sand blasting. This is an original system but I had just thrown it on the car without ever looking at its condition. Turns out it was a little bit sick. The small boxes should have a decent chunk of copper in there to seal it to the muffler, this had all but vanished, along with dodge joints to the heat exchanger and last but not least the piss poor job someone had done welding on an original tail pipe into some old beetle smaller diameter exhaust. If youve stuck with me, the reason for explaining that is, I set up my engine with a carb balancer and CO meter, needles to say I had it running way over rich as the tail pipe was the last place to be emitting and gas. It had long since buggered off before it stood a chance of making its way that far through the system. End result coked pistons and heads, and the very grotty oil. To that end I had to do something about it, the type 3 had a bespoke tail pipe diameter so there was no way I was going to be able to borrow from the parts bin to make good. Not wanting to was years on a simple fix, I found this perfectly diametered exhaust repair section on ebay for four of our queens finest pounds.

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Roughly a foot long wit ha 2 inch flared end I could make a sliding tail pipe. With not a moment to waste, out with the tube cutter.

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I cleaned up the face on the silencer and with rough measurements.

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Not as VW intended, but a quick and serviceable repair, once fitted to the car I will clamp the sleeve to seal it up.

The heat exchangers were a less pretty site, though ive yet to do anything about these yet.

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And just because I went to the effort of taking photos.

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Dont tell the missus, but i sat in front of the stove and masked off the black areas ready for the silver.

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At some point during all this waffle I got a phone call to say my wallet needed emptying and I got this box of shrink wrap.

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There has been much debate on these fellas (if you want me to waffle on about them do ask, but otherwise I will spare you), anyway my question wasnt to fit or not. It was regarding orientation. Those of you who can count will have noticed the 4 cylinders, and these chaps only have three wings.

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My logic suggested to me this was the correct way around. Number 2 being well cooled if not best cooled. Closely followed by No.1

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Where as 3 and 4 also share with the oil cooler, 3 being well know as the worst cooled. The little wing should direct a little more air flow around the head just to help a few degrees. Rational to my thoughts?

Added goodies from VWHeritage.

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Suddenly a long block.

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Ive grown tired of typing this evening, I will finish the story tomorrow.
The sultan of swing

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purplepeter
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by purplepeter » 7th December 2018 - 9:26am

I was poised to call you rude names there, when it looked like You were fitting the cool tins on top!( in practice, they'll only fit one way)
Have you got/do you need the copper crush rings?- if not, bung me your address.
My advice would be to fit the boxes to the silencer before offering it up to the engine, otherwise the buggers drop out/go skew whiff.
If You needed a tailpipe, you could have just asked!

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 9:58am

Haha, as im sure you've guess that was for illustrative purposes. But I cant see anything to stop me swapping those from left to right? and in fact I have fitted them the other way in the past. Which meant there was no "wing" on number 3 cylinder I can find nothing via google regarding the correct way to fit them. I will send you my address, ive got some copper rings but the real thing would be better ta.

I will be taking you advice regarding the fitting, the tail pipe was ok, it was the crap beetle heat exhanger stub on the silencer which it had been sleeved down to suit which was the problem. It was a nice easy fix in the end. :D
The sultan of swing

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 10:44am

Feeling a little more awake then. The fan housing needed building back up, but as it was nice and clean, this was a joy to do.

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With the flaps and linkage reinstated.

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And rehomed with a few of its other friends. Were racing through it now.

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I continued the build up fairly slowly, making sure everything was properly aligned and every fitting suitably lubed to help me undo it when the day finally came, and to keep the fan flaps moving as they should.

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A friend of mine recent visited California and said he could pop into ISP west if i needed any bits, as I want to revive the original heating system (hence the efforts with an original muffler ect) I had managed to collect all the parts required other than the two small diameter hoses which carry the cool air to the top of the mixer boxes behind the rear seat. I couldn't find a single UK supplier, but ISP stocked some so he brought me these back.

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One happy chap!

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Some hours later I got to this.

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I had painted the coil the closest blue I had kicking around in the garage, its too dark but it will do for now and I even bought some cheesey stickers just because.

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In pursuit of the heater system I had these mixer boxes cleaned up and blasted. I stripped the thermostats out and get them a few coats of stove paint.

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And tested the thermostats on the stove, both of which open and close smoothly.

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With that complete i rebuilt them, setting the correct pre load on the thermostat of 1mm. I just need to go fetch the gaskets Ive had made and they're ready to go on. Then there wont be much stopping me fitting the engine.

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ANd so I fear we have caught up, well just about. I feel rather pleased with how its all gone. Though with an exam looming next week I can see progress coming to a stop for 4 or 5 days.
The sultan of swing

jake@facewest.co.uk
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by jake@facewest.co.uk » 7th December 2018 - 5:28pm

That's tons of progress. Well done. Engine looking good.

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 7th December 2018 - 8:29pm

Nice progress there. Where did you get the thermostat preload setting from.
I was looking for that last night on the web, but no luck ??

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 7th December 2018 - 8:42pm

Got it,
Volkswagen Official manual.
Just opened mine to engine section. ha,ha.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 9:44pm

Haha, I was going to say, you'll need to get yourself a Bentley manual on the Christmas list. But you've got the real deal. And yeah its in the same section. I have just installed mine with the new gaskets I had made
The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 7th December 2018 - 9:53pm

It was from last years christmas list, but I didn,t need specific tech detail
up til now. All the metal bashing kept me occupied. Finally made it to the re assemble
with nice shiny bits.
Just cleaned and sprayed up my own units, and checked for working thermostats too.

All good

At long last...

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 9:56pm

The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 7th December 2018 - 10:36pm

Gaskets, no fortunately not. I have one perfect one, and a bag of Nebar
gasket material that I picked up at a boot sale for a pittance.

So i,ll make the new one no problem.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 10:43pm

Top stuff, looks iike were both level pegging on the rebuild front :D
The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 7th December 2018 - 10:47pm

Yeah, except your body and chassis are one, whereas mine are
like a divorced couple


Do the stove fans work well for you.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 7th December 2018 - 10:57pm

Yes, they're amazing. The stove keeps the house tepid all day, when i get in from work the central heating kicks in and warms everything up in half and hour. In the mean time i stoke the stove up and get the fans blowing which then keeps the warmth in the house all evening. Saving a fortune on the central heating bill. Inf you're thinking about for your garage. I would say go for it. I use one on a stove in a log cabin that's around a triple garage size and its the difference between a warm and cold kitchen
The sultan of swing

Aaronslimvw
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by Aaronslimvw » 7th December 2018 - 11:01pm

Great work! Engine looks lovely!

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 8th December 2018 - 11:54am

So basically the preload is keeping the locking nut away from the thermostat base
by 1 mm, once the top valve is seated to the body.

If the locking nut was 5 mm away, how would it make a difference either way.
Am I looking at this wrong??

Checked the thermostat working too. Moves extensively for sure.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 8th December 2018 - 12:00pm

Cheers, I hope it runs lovely.

Yeah I was confused by that. Seems like a dodgy diagram to me. I took it to mean, get the thermostat valve touching the top of the heater box and then screw the thermostat down 1mm further and lock with the lock nut.
The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 8th December 2018 - 12:08pm

Yeah thats what i thought.
Pity bentley wouldn,t say that.
Runs perfectly, and a lot of movement in the valve which surprised me.

When its open , there would be a major surplus hot airflow bypassing
the car back out the pipe so

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 8th December 2018 - 12:26pm

Checked it fully assembled with a heat gun. Works beautifully.
Dont you just love simple german engineering.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 8th December 2018 - 12:30pm

I don't understand when the valve opens cool air flows in and mixes with the warm air flowing into the car.
The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 8th December 2018 - 1:39pm

Ahh....

There's me thinking surplus hot air goes from that box, back to the engine tubes.
But as you say, cool air gets sucked in at the thermostat box.

All makes sense now,

Volume of hot air, and force of flow from the heat exchangers to this box,
causes an influx of cool air, when this valve opens, and mixes here.

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broady_6
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by broady_6 » 8th December 2018 - 1:42pm

It doesnt get sucked, its blowing in from the engine fan. it sounds to be like you are missing some bits from your system.

http://www.vwtype3and4club.org.uk/forum ... 274#p66259

items 30 and 42 link the elbows on the fan housing to the top of those mixer boxes and there where the cool air is blown in.
The sultan of swing

kaddy
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Re: 1971 VW Type 3 Fastback

Post by kaddy » 8th December 2018 - 5:55pm

Yeah, air gets blown through the heat exchangers, from the engine fan. Agreed.

My system is complete no problem, air gets blown in through 42 and 30 which I have .

All good so, things lost in translation :D

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