1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

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Editor
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Editor » 8th September 2013 - 2:43am

Any help? http://home.clara.net/hallvw/type3/T3pbo/T3pb2-24.htm
or http://home.clara.net/hallvw/type3/T3pbo/T3pb2-50.htm .

There are other illustrations of different models which I've not scanned yet.
Dave.

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Marko
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 8th September 2013 - 5:11pm

well, I'm starting to get a little fed up with the Fastback now, it seems like I'll never get it running right, it's sounds like it's only running on 3 cylinders now :( I took it for a run today and had to rev it quite a bit in 2nd to get it to go up a hill and when I got home the engine felt like it's overheated a bit.. not sure what/if there's any damage just yet until I have a proper look but the oil was on minimum which maybe didn't help.

I don't know what it is with me and classic cars but I'm never happy/confident with how they run hence me not going to any shows further a field.

what to do?
my 1968 Fastback Automatic build thread
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dubboy79
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by dubboy79 » 8th September 2013 - 8:10pm

Wow wished my 71fastback looked in that kind of condition,Sold my T25 a couple of weeks ago and decided to finally treat my self to a fastback found one through a guy on the dreaded ebay was told it was solid.After a arriving in manchester at 6pm in evening after a 4 hour drive payed the guy and jumped straight in and drove for another 5 hours including stops.but on inspectiopn in the morning found its ruffer than thought but never mind got a full resto on the go now happy days.good luck with yours will update some pics of my one when get chance :D

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Marko
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 8th September 2013 - 8:16pm

I wish I had the confidence to jump in mine and do a 5 hour drive!! start a build thread, I love to see other peoples builds!
my 1968 Fastback Automatic build thread
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alex d
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by alex d » 9th September 2013 - 3:29pm

Marko, have you measured compressions on your engine? I too kept chasing my tail with timing and carbs until I realized I had a dead cylinder!
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 9th September 2013 - 3:39pm

alex d wrote:Marko, have you measured compressions on your engine?
it's on my to do list.. going to have a look in a bit see if I can find anything obvious wrong, I'm sure the cooling was OK as thermostat was working but will have to check the flaps are opening (they were when engine was out)

I'm still not convinced the timing was correct but with so many different views on what it should be and how to check/do it I was kinda lost..
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Creationblue
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Creationblue » 9th September 2013 - 4:26pm

Great work there 8)

Where did you get your carpets and did you put anything on the pans before fitting?

Just
Way out west

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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 9th September 2013 - 5:23pm

Creationblue wrote:Great work there 8)

Where did you get your carpets and did you put anything on the pans before fitting?

Just
Spirit of the 50's I think, they were with the car when I bought it, seem good quality anyway.

it has a layer of sound deadening and felt too for good measure! it's reasonably quiet in there for a VW :lol:
Last edited by Marko on 9th September 2013 - 5:28pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 9th September 2013 - 5:24pm

this is the state my plugs are in, looks like it's running a little rich? at least they all look the same!

Image

Image

done a compression test too, these are the results, I did the test with engine cold, not sure if that's correct or not?

#1 - 150psi
#2 - 142psi
#3 - 140psi
#4 - 150psi

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Creationblue
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Creationblue » 9th September 2013 - 5:50pm

According to the Haynes the compression should be between 114 - 142 psi, so I think the engine it strong 8)

Got any pics of the felt underlay going down? Not ready to do mine yet but wanna get an idea of what's needed

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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 9th September 2013 - 6:02pm

this is similar stuff to what I used.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-5-x-1-Metre ... 3a82cd1fbf
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Creationblue
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Creationblue » 9th September 2013 - 6:39pm

Marko wrote:this is similar stuff to what I used.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-5-x-1-Metre ... 3a82cd1fbf
Perfect thanks 8)
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Editor » 10th September 2013 - 2:39am

No. 1 plug is maybe a fraction rich, but you can't adjust them separately anyway - you could check the gaps are correct, and the spark-plug cables are similar resistances (about 1KOhm). Ignore the rim of the plug - black soot on there is normal. The insulation on the centre electrode is where to look. I'd say they're all OK.
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 10th September 2013 - 5:52am

OK if compression is fine and carbs not running rich then I'm back to square 1 with no idea what's wrong! (probably timing :lol: )

I'll buy new plugs today and check leads with multi-meter.

oh, and I checked the thermostat with hot air gun, it opens fine and the bar rotates 90 degrees next to distributor so my cooling should be OK? the only thing I can think of on the cooling system that might compromise cooling is the water drain flaps that are missing, should I just temporary cover these up to see if it makes a difference?
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alex d
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by alex d » 10th September 2013 - 8:57am

Those compressions look pretty good!

Things I would do now, even if they've been done recently you want to make sure everything is where it should be:

1) recheck valve gaps (0.15mm cold)
2) make sure you don't have any vacuum leaks, that's between intakes and head, carbs and intakes, and specially all the balance hoses plus the one to the auto trans
3) at least take out idle jets and mixture screws and spray carb cleaner in there (of course a full carb cleaning would be preferable)
4) adjust point gap
5) adjust timing, didn't you have a dual vacuum advance-retard distributor? For now I'd ignore the retard hose, plug it and set it to 7,5 static and see how it goes
6) sync your carbs and adjust mixture and idle speed, oh, while you're there make sure the chokes work like they should (fully open around a couple minutes after first starting a cold engine)

which carbs did you have in there? (the VW number that is), it's a long shot but make sure you have the right jets in them
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 10th September 2013 - 9:25am

I'll check carb numbers and report back. I did rebuild them several times to be sure they were OK.

Engine had a rebuild before I got it so happy with the results I got!

As you know I've never been happy with timing and distributor. The vacuum can is from an FI model but there's not a lot I can do when parts are impossible to find (:

Mark.
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 10th September 2013 - 6:09pm

spent some time on the engine today after work and found a few things not 100%..

did the valve clearances and a couple of valves were either tight or loose, not a lot but not right.

#2 plug lead had no resistance, this was down to the right angle connection on cap not been seated right :oops:

points were too tight.

then I tried to do the timing static again (will I ever be able to lick this timing lark? :lol: ), I reckon it was at about 12.5 degrees BTDC so tried to adjust it and the condenser screw pinged off :roll: why is this job such a toll? does anybody else have to take the fuel pump off and distributor just to fix the condenser? or am I doing something very wrong? is my condenser the correct type, I don't have much room to adjust things down there! any pics of a correct set up would be appreciated!

Image

Image
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by jmarkha1 » 10th September 2013 - 8:32pm

May be worth upgrading to a Pertronix electronic ignition unit - you can lose the condenser, never adjust points again and get consistent spark.
Carry the points and condenser as a get home in case the unit gave up (unlikely).
My dad's car never ran quite right and we went through so many variations - in the end changed to electronic ignition and it was night and day - worth thinking about if you have been around the houses a bit getting it to run right.
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 11th September 2013 - 4:54pm

I think I'm getting there, managed to statically time the engine to 7.5 degrees BTDC and the engine sounds pretty decent now, just need to take it for a drive and see how it performs.

I'm not sure whether to try electronic ignition, changing that condenser is a real pain! if it fails by the roadside I'm screwed!
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Editor » 11th September 2013 - 6:01pm

Some of the newer Pertronix units gained a reputation for failing after a couple of years service in the USA, but I've no first-hand knowledge of them. It may have been due to overheating problems in a hotter climate than we usually get.
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Marko
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 12th September 2013 - 5:11pm

feeling quite good about the fastback now, just fired it up after been stood 24hrs and fired up straight away and sounded really well and strong, better than it's ever sounded!

back with the little Eberpacher project, this is where I'm up to! not tried it on the bench since the rebuild but it looks well if anything! pump detailed and new hoses/filter and "T" piece ready.

I still haven't done anything about brackets or drilling holes in car yet (eek!)

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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Editor » 13th September 2013 - 1:45pm

Very pretty.

Keep a close eye on the 'premium quality' hose. I have a theory that anything that implies it's not crap is under suspicion! Like the 'Bulldog' branded brake hoses that cracked before the next MoT was due - clearly trying to make out they were good quality British and reliable. Or like the local washing machine service guy who went on about 'cowboys' while fitting some new brake shoes and told me the washing-machine motor was broken when it didn't run properly after the job. Luckily my wife spotted the shoes said 'top' on the visible underside!
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 13th September 2013 - 3:38pm

some of the fuel hose came from GSF, possibly both sizes can't remember now but all the hoses on my car have been on at least 12 months now and still seem OK.
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Dave G
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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Dave G » 14th September 2013 - 8:49am

Not sure if it is, but I think fuel hose deserves it's own thread for the amount of times I've had to change my engine bay pipes! I'm currently looking into what to buy to change them again soon!

That heater looks superb - restored my faith in Hammerite paints in fact!

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Re: 1968 1600TL Fastback Automatic

Post by Marko » 14th September 2013 - 4:26pm

took it for a spin today to GSF for warm air hose and drove like a dream, very happy but had a bit of an episode when I got back :oops: I parked it up for about an hour and when I got back in it it refused to start (here we go again I thought :roll: ). the left hand carb was not squirting fuel so took it off and hardly any fuel in bowl. fuel pressure was at 3psi so OK there I think.. historically I've had fuel problems and fitted an extra washer under the cut off valve so removed this and fitted another float, with 2 floats side by side the old one sits lower so actuating cut off valve too soon.

is there any cure to stopping fuel evaporating like that? or was I just running that carb with a low amount of fuel all the time so evaporated it all very easy? funny enough it's happened twice at my friends house and his street is on a bit of a hill (not much though)
my 1968 Fastback Automatic build thread
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